Comments
Posted by frothynoodlesoup :: 
:: 
:: Jan 04, 2004 07:10pm
:: :: Jan 04, 2004 07:10pmthe thing i never understood is why people make such a big deal out of being gay. its no ones business what anyone does with they're sex life, and the only reason that its an issue is because of the part of the conservative mentality that says it should govern what hole i stick my dick in.
Posted by Erin :: 
:: :: Jan 29, 2004 03:54pm
:: :: Jan 29, 2004 03:54pmTo make a quick correction... I believe the only reason people care if someone's gay is because those who are gay run around telling everyone about it in parades and protests and rallies. I have no problem with homosexuals at all whatsoever and if they didn't shout it from the rooftops no one else would either.
Posted by David S. :: :: 
:: Jan 30, 2004 03:55am
:: :: Jan 30, 2004 03:55amFrom the look of your post, I would assume you do have a problem with homosexuals. Deny it all you want, but you wouldn't say something like that if you truly didn't have a problem with us.
To make a few corrections of my own:
1) Not all gay people "run around telling everyone about it in parades and protests and rallies."
2) These parades and protests and rallies started back in 1969. Gays and lesbians were being discriminated against centuries before that. The christian bible is an example of some of the early discrimination.
3) Homosexuals started protesting in public because they were beaten and arrested by cops just for being gay.
4) The reason people care if someone is gay is because they are taught to. Just like the saying "No child is born a racist," the same can be said here... No child is born homophobic.
If you don't believe me, read about the first gay protest. Or pick something from this list
About the whole homosexuals in society thing... Have you ever kissed anyone in public? Have you ever held hands or affectionately hugged anyone in public? I often see guys getting very intimate with girls in public. A lot of people may dislike public affection, but nobody ever complains if it is a guy and girl couple. However, when I sit in a restaurant booth next to another guy, at least a foot away from each other, people make comments like "which one of you is the bitch?" These are the same people that would stick their hand down their partner's pants in the middle of a mall or public park full of children.
I don't want to make out with a guy in public. I think that is inappropriate. I would like to be able to sit quietly next to my boyfriend without being called a faggot. I just want to live in peace. But people won't let me live in peace, so I will stand up and shout from the rooftops. Just like the women, African Americans, and all the other minorities, I want to be treated the same as everyone else. And the only way to achieve that is to make people see the homosexual lifestyle until they have seen it so much that they ignore it. My protest will end when people no longer feel that they have to pass laws against homosexuality. Because it was those laws that forced me to come out of the darkness and start protesting in the first place.
To make a few corrections of my own:
1) Not all gay people "run around telling everyone about it in parades and protests and rallies."
2) These parades and protests and rallies started back in 1969. Gays and lesbians were being discriminated against centuries before that. The christian bible is an example of some of the early discrimination.
3) Homosexuals started protesting in public because they were beaten and arrested by cops just for being gay.
4) The reason people care if someone is gay is because they are taught to. Just like the saying "No child is born a racist," the same can be said here... No child is born homophobic.
If you don't believe me, read about the first gay protest. Or pick something from this list
About the whole homosexuals in society thing... Have you ever kissed anyone in public? Have you ever held hands or affectionately hugged anyone in public? I often see guys getting very intimate with girls in public. A lot of people may dislike public affection, but nobody ever complains if it is a guy and girl couple. However, when I sit in a restaurant booth next to another guy, at least a foot away from each other, people make comments like "which one of you is the bitch?" These are the same people that would stick their hand down their partner's pants in the middle of a mall or public park full of children.
I don't want to make out with a guy in public. I think that is inappropriate. I would like to be able to sit quietly next to my boyfriend without being called a faggot. I just want to live in peace. But people won't let me live in peace, so I will stand up and shout from the rooftops. Just like the women, African Americans, and all the other minorities, I want to be treated the same as everyone else. And the only way to achieve that is to make people see the homosexual lifestyle until they have seen it so much that they ignore it. My protest will end when people no longer feel that they have to pass laws against homosexuality. Because it was those laws that forced me to come out of the darkness and start protesting in the first place.
Posted by E_B_A :: :: :: Jan 04, 2004 11:22pm
:: :: Jan 04, 2004 11:22pmI could argue so much on both sides (and I have a great deal of respect for both Ryland AND his opinions, make no mistake) but I think I'll have to (for now) leave it at:
Ted Turner: clearly an ultra-rich conservative. I mean, he does own all those media outlets and they're all owned by ultra-rich conservatives. Ergo, Ted's a conservative.
But in the end I know you're just having fun and even though I'm pro-life, support gun rights and feel there is a certain amount of religious persecution from a grass-roots liberal media (as opposed to the corporate side of the media which IS, sad to say, mostly conservative), I understand it's all fun and games and I'm offended by nothing here.
Good reading as always, Ryland.
Ted Turner: clearly an ultra-rich conservative. I mean, he does own all those media outlets and they're all owned by ultra-rich conservatives. Ergo, Ted's a conservative.
But in the end I know you're just having fun and even though I'm pro-life, support gun rights and feel there is a certain amount of religious persecution from a grass-roots liberal media (as opposed to the corporate side of the media which IS, sad to say, mostly conservative), I understand it's all fun and games and I'm offended by nothing here.
Good reading as always, Ryland.
Posted by Ryland :: :: :: Jan 05, 2004 01:47am
:: :: Jan 05, 2004 01:47amThanks! Yeah, the list I did is pretty from-the-hip, as I'm sure the original was.
Posted by hon_mouse :: :: :: Jan 06, 2004 04:38pm
:: :: Jan 06, 2004 04:38pmWhile Ted Turner is a good example of a "liberal" media tycoon... he is a former media tycoon. He sold out to Time Warner, which sold out to AOL, which was headed for many years (until just recently) by a very conservative Steve Case. Clearly, however, the bias of AOL-Time Warner-CNN is and was corporate.
Posted by Jake :: :: :: Jan 05, 2004 01:05am
:: :: Jan 05, 2004 01:05amMan, I'm screwed then, ain't I?
Even though I finally made the switch from being a Republican to a Democrat, I find that I agree and disagree with statements in both camps.
Ah hell... I'll just go an become an anarchist. It'll work too! It just hasn't worked anywhere it's been tried because the right people haven't been in charge.
Wait... That doesn't scan. Never mind. Fuck you Ryland, for making my head implode.
Even though I finally made the switch from being a Republican to a Democrat, I find that I agree and disagree with statements in both camps.
Ah hell... I'll just go an become an anarchist. It'll work too! It just hasn't worked anywhere it's been tried because the right people haven't been in charge.
Wait... That doesn't scan. Never mind. Fuck you Ryland, for making my head implode.
Posted by Ryland :: :: :: Jan 05, 2004 01:49am
:: :: Jan 05, 2004 01:49amEven though I finally made the switch from being a Republican to a Democrat, I find that I agree and disagree with statements in both camps.
Yeah, I'm pretty centrist myself. I actually agree with what a lot of conservatives are saying right now, that the Bush administration shouldn't really be considered conservative per se because they don't go for classic conservative ideas like smaller, less intrusive government, etc.
Yeah, I'm pretty centrist myself. I actually agree with what a lot of conservatives are saying right now, that the Bush administration shouldn't really be considered conservative per se because they don't go for classic conservative ideas like smaller, less intrusive government, etc.
Posted by tj :: :: :: Jan 05, 2004 08:38am
:: :: Jan 05, 2004 08:38ami'm the same way ... very middle-of-the-road. i don't think any person is truly 100% right or left ... although my dad leans VERY far to the right. so guess who's going to get this list in his email. hee hee.
Posted by James D. :: :: :: Jan 06, 2004 03:20am
:: :: Jan 06, 2004 03:20amI dunno. The Republican "reply" didn't really do it for me. I don't care what political persuasion you are. It's your freedom to affiliate with those who share your views. I have no problem with that. However, some of your replies just weren't all that great and some bordered on completely ignorant. I'm a Libertarian, personally. So, quite frankly, I hate both parties equally, just in different ways. So, if you read this, don't think I'm some raving conservative loony because I'm definitely not.
2. You have to believe that the evolution is a myth that shouldn't be taught in schools, despite the evidence of biochemistry and the fossil record.
--No argument there.
3. You have to believe that there is no causal link between legal, easily-obtainable handguns and high murder rates.
--The number of TOTAL crimes (not just murders, but robberies, assaults, et al) committed each year by legally-owned firearms is less than the number of deaths in bathtubs accidents each year. There is nothing wrong with allowing law abiding citizens easier access to firearms since criminals are going to be able to get guns anyway.
5. You have to believe that homosexuality is evil (despite the fact that it occurs in nature) and that women should stay at home to cook and bear children.
--Not all Republicans are mysoginistic assholes, as you seem to be implying. But I do agree with you on the homosexuality comment. I say let them do as they wish as long as they don't force their views on my lifestyle. I mean, what are they doing to harm anyone else? So, I half agree with you on this one.
6. You have to be against abortion but support capital punishment.
--I'm for both. But, your argument here is kind of contradictory (unless you have a different set of morals than I do.) If I had to choose one or the other, I'd say let the violent criminals die before the unborn ones who never did anything to harm someone else. But, since I'm a Libertarian, I believe in both wholeheartedly.
7. You have to believe that businesses never purposely hurt anyone to make money.
--Look, I think it's obvious that businesses purposely hurt people all the time; but, I seriously doubt that the majority of people who would identify themselves as conservatives would say that all businesses are squeaky clean 100% of the time. You'd have to be pretty damn gullible to believe that.
9. You have to believe that inherited wealth is more important than actually doing something to earn it.
--I'm not sure exactly what you're implying with this one. Because the vast majority of rich people made their money by working ungodly amounts of hours for decades sacrificing any semblance of a normal life to become rich. I may be mistaken, but I think only 11-13% of people who are worth over $100,000 inherited said wealth.
10. You have to believe that war is an acceptable solution to any economic or social problem.
--Being a Libertarian, I was against the war, too, so no argument on this one.
12. You have to believe the NRA is good because it supports certain parts of the Constitution, while the ACLU is bad because it supports certain parts of the Constitution.
--The ACLU ardently defends child abusers and molesters. Odd, I can't seem to find that right defined anywhere in the Constitution. That's why I hate them.
13. You have to believe that taxes are for poor and middle class people, not the rich.
--Check the I.R.S.'s tax statistics from 2000. The rich are paying well more than their "fair share", I ASSURE you. And riddle me this: if you are poor and not paying much or anything at all, how can you expect to get much of anything back? And I'm in the middle class. I know we get fucked worse than anyone, but it's not like the rich aren't paying taxes.
14. You have to believe that affirmative action is wrong, while still supporting discrimination against minorities.
--??? Affirmative action IS wrong. In every imaginable way. And what do you mean by "supporting discrimination against minorities"?
15. You have to believe that Ann Coulter is normal and really a very nice person.
--Heh, you'll get no argument from me there. Syphilis will do that to a person. I think she'd call a dog "un-American" if it didn't want to go to war.
17. You have to believe liberals telling the truth belong in jail, but a liar and draft-dodger belongs in the White House.
--Um...Bill Clinton anyone?
18. You have to believe that the Ten Commandments should be displayed in every public building regardless of the fact that not everyone in America is a Christian.
--I agree with you on this, also.
19. You have to believe that illegal Republican Party funding by corporations is somehow in the best interest of the United States.
--Oh, please. Both parties are up to their eyeballs in shady corporate funding. It isn't just the Republicans.
20. You have to believe that the media are biased toward liberals, despite the fact that all the major media outlets are owned by ultra-rich conservatives.
--If you think Ted Turner and Howell Raines (and MANY others) are conservatives, then I'd like to buy some of whatever you're smoking because it must be some DAMN POWERFUL STUFF.
I'd say I'm about 50/50 on this thing as a whole. I'm probably taking this way too seriously, but eh. I love the site, though. Cheers.
2. You have to believe that the evolution is a myth that shouldn't be taught in schools, despite the evidence of biochemistry and the fossil record.
--No argument there.
3. You have to believe that there is no causal link between legal, easily-obtainable handguns and high murder rates.
--The number of TOTAL crimes (not just murders, but robberies, assaults, et al) committed each year by legally-owned firearms is less than the number of deaths in bathtubs accidents each year. There is nothing wrong with allowing law abiding citizens easier access to firearms since criminals are going to be able to get guns anyway.
5. You have to believe that homosexuality is evil (despite the fact that it occurs in nature) and that women should stay at home to cook and bear children.
--Not all Republicans are mysoginistic assholes, as you seem to be implying. But I do agree with you on the homosexuality comment. I say let them do as they wish as long as they don't force their views on my lifestyle. I mean, what are they doing to harm anyone else? So, I half agree with you on this one.
6. You have to be against abortion but support capital punishment.
--I'm for both. But, your argument here is kind of contradictory (unless you have a different set of morals than I do.) If I had to choose one or the other, I'd say let the violent criminals die before the unborn ones who never did anything to harm someone else. But, since I'm a Libertarian, I believe in both wholeheartedly.
7. You have to believe that businesses never purposely hurt anyone to make money.
--Look, I think it's obvious that businesses purposely hurt people all the time; but, I seriously doubt that the majority of people who would identify themselves as conservatives would say that all businesses are squeaky clean 100% of the time. You'd have to be pretty damn gullible to believe that.
9. You have to believe that inherited wealth is more important than actually doing something to earn it.
--I'm not sure exactly what you're implying with this one. Because the vast majority of rich people made their money by working ungodly amounts of hours for decades sacrificing any semblance of a normal life to become rich. I may be mistaken, but I think only 11-13% of people who are worth over $100,000 inherited said wealth.
10. You have to believe that war is an acceptable solution to any economic or social problem.
--Being a Libertarian, I was against the war, too, so no argument on this one.
12. You have to believe the NRA is good because it supports certain parts of the Constitution, while the ACLU is bad because it supports certain parts of the Constitution.
--The ACLU ardently defends child abusers and molesters. Odd, I can't seem to find that right defined anywhere in the Constitution. That's why I hate them.
13. You have to believe that taxes are for poor and middle class people, not the rich.
--Check the I.R.S.'s tax statistics from 2000. The rich are paying well more than their "fair share", I ASSURE you. And riddle me this: if you are poor and not paying much or anything at all, how can you expect to get much of anything back? And I'm in the middle class. I know we get fucked worse than anyone, but it's not like the rich aren't paying taxes.
14. You have to believe that affirmative action is wrong, while still supporting discrimination against minorities.
--??? Affirmative action IS wrong. In every imaginable way. And what do you mean by "supporting discrimination against minorities"?
15. You have to believe that Ann Coulter is normal and really a very nice person.
--Heh, you'll get no argument from me there. Syphilis will do that to a person. I think she'd call a dog "un-American" if it didn't want to go to war.
17. You have to believe liberals telling the truth belong in jail, but a liar and draft-dodger belongs in the White House.
--Um...Bill Clinton anyone?
18. You have to believe that the Ten Commandments should be displayed in every public building regardless of the fact that not everyone in America is a Christian.
--I agree with you on this, also.
19. You have to believe that illegal Republican Party funding by corporations is somehow in the best interest of the United States.
--Oh, please. Both parties are up to their eyeballs in shady corporate funding. It isn't just the Republicans.
20. You have to believe that the media are biased toward liberals, despite the fact that all the major media outlets are owned by ultra-rich conservatives.
--If you think Ted Turner and Howell Raines (and MANY others) are conservatives, then I'd like to buy some of whatever you're smoking because it must be some DAMN POWERFUL STUFF.
I'd say I'm about 50/50 on this thing as a whole. I'm probably taking this way too seriously, but eh. I love the site, though. Cheers.
Posted by E_B_A :: :: :: Jan 06, 2004 09:34am
:: :: Jan 06, 2004 09:34amFellow Libertarian here... we disagree on some things but I imagine we see eye to eye on most...
But rich people not paying taxes. I think this is misapplied by those saying it and those defending it.
Rich folks at the bottom of the scale, that is to say, folks who might be worth $5 million as opposed to $50 million or $100 million, those rich yet not ultra-rich folks pay more then their fair share of taxes. But once you get up to a certain amount, it's easier to pay less to no taxes at all. Leona Helmsly springs to mind. As does Enron, Cheney, Bush and numerous others. Whether legal or not, they are not paying taxes or much taxes.
Which is why I've long proposed that, if we are to have a tax structure (and I think we shouldn't), at least make it fair like a national sales tax or something of that nature as opposed to the IRS and their extortive "let's take it away from you before you get it and make your employer the responsible party" mentality.
Otherwise, great response and this has been an excellent post all around and great reading.
But rich people not paying taxes. I think this is misapplied by those saying it and those defending it.
Rich folks at the bottom of the scale, that is to say, folks who might be worth $5 million as opposed to $50 million or $100 million, those rich yet not ultra-rich folks pay more then their fair share of taxes. But once you get up to a certain amount, it's easier to pay less to no taxes at all. Leona Helmsly springs to mind. As does Enron, Cheney, Bush and numerous others. Whether legal or not, they are not paying taxes or much taxes.
Which is why I've long proposed that, if we are to have a tax structure (and I think we shouldn't), at least make it fair like a national sales tax or something of that nature as opposed to the IRS and their extortive "let's take it away from you before you get it and make your employer the responsible party" mentality.
Otherwise, great response and this has been an excellent post all around and great reading.
Posted by Erin :: :: :: Jan 29, 2004 04:47pm
:: :: Jan 29, 2004 04:47pmI am a pretty avid Republican, but I agree with you on much of what you said... and those parts I don't agree with you on I respect you for, since you have the intelligence and candor to honestly distinguish between fact and fantacy... well done analysis.
Posted by Ryland :: :: :: Jan 29, 2004 08:58pm
:: :: Jan 29, 2004 08:58pmI probably should have replied to this weeks ago, but I didn't, so here goes anyway. Many of the points you raise are perfectly correct, and the reason is because I wrote the Republican list to match the hysterical tone of the original Democrat list. I realize that not all Republicans are corporatist zombies, just as I realize that not all Democrats are hippie socialists - it's a satire as much as anything.
Posted by Donald :: :: :: Jan 06, 2004 04:39pm
:: :: Jan 06, 2004 04:39pm That's why I'm a Libertarian. Also a registered democrat and a registered republican, so I can vote in the primaries.
Pretty good website and excellent name.
http://geocities/dbargerjr/
Pretty good website and excellent name.
http://geocities/dbargerjr/
Posted by tina :: :: :: Jan 30, 2004 06:03pm
:: :: Jan 30, 2004 06:03pmYou have to believe that homosexuality is evil (despite the fact that it occurs in nature)...
By that logic then infanticide should be legal, women should be allowed to kill men after having sex with them, it's okay for fathers to abandon their children, and random acts of brutal violence should be condoned.
By that logic then infanticide should be legal, women should be allowed to kill men after having sex with them, it's okay for fathers to abandon their children, and random acts of brutal violence should be condoned.
Posted by Ryland :: :: :: Jan 30, 2004 09:06pm
:: :: Jan 30, 2004 09:06pmNow you got it!
Just kidding. As I've said several times now, that list was written A) in haste, and B) in the same hysterical tone as the "how to be a democrat" list. Although I believe some of those things, please don't assume that I believe all of them.
Just kidding. As I've said several times now, that list was written A) in haste, and B) in the same hysterical tone as the "how to be a democrat" list. Although I believe some of those things, please don't assume that I believe all of them.
Posted by echo of reason :: :: :: Feb 12, 2004 07:01pm
:: :: Feb 12, 2004 07:01pmno you got your logic all mixed up. It would actually be the other way...good idea though.
Echo of reason
Echo of reason
Posted by An Echo of Reason :: :: :: Feb 12, 2004 01:12pm
:: :: Feb 12, 2004 01:12pmoh dear, oh dear, oh my, oh shit. ladies and gents there is a horrible problem here. While I am enjoying this website the problem stems from its misguided focus. Indeed this target has been missed by all of society. However, it is of no fault of our own. We have been duped. The left and the right are one in the same. We are so tangled up in hating each other that we never stop to look at what is really going on in the world. The great problems we face: AIDS, famine and hunger, terrorism, etc etc etc. if we would step back and work together toward solutions that work because they work rather than toss out buzz words that allow our CAREER politicians to fuel the "us vs them" mentality that holds them in office...well then maybe this world wouldn't be the shit hole its turned into. maybe my biggest frustration with the world is that there is so much potential for achievement. The level of communication is unbelievable. that fact that you are reading this right now means there are channels already thriving. In the past underground movements worked for years to develop political networks that would take people today only a few months if our technology was utilized correctly. I call to you, rise up. Start someting powerful in this world. Don't just stand in line and take what the powers throw to you. Republican or Democrat: these are not the only choices! what happened to new parties forming and working to gain power? One might argue that only those powerful parties that already exist can achive what I want. NO NO NO! you can't achive anything through those channels anymore. They are dead! the power has been sapped by a huge buracracy and politicians who have made this their careers. These parties were small once too. Everything that is big and powerful today was oneday small and in danger of being crushed but people that cared rose up and fought for them. That is why we have these two parties. They did something right. They got everyone behind them and then said "don't follow anyone else you'll throw you vote away." Stay away from this sleepwalker mindset. Wake your mind up to the possiblity of change. I don't care if I agree with you stance or not. I want to see you create a party and contest the powers that be! I'll support you! People will agree! but we need to open the doors and wake up their minds. This is a big picture kind of problem. When we get to a point where we have many options with open and different voices giving their input we will discuss views. But now we need to work to support each other! Help small parties support the little guys. Honestly, if everyone "throws their vote away" on a thrid party then what the major parties fear most will happen: they will both lose power! Come on people Rise up!!!
- An Echo of Reason
- An Echo of Reason
Am I going crazy or are we living through a trend where the thinking has gone back to a 1950s style? I work at a book store; we have a social science section where about 85% of the books are bible thumping, gay bashing, and republicans. I have noticed that we are currently getting more requests in daily for these books. The newest Michael Savage book, The Enemy Within: Saving America from the Liberal Assault on Our Schools, Faith, and Military, was placed in front of the store on the "we recommend" shelf. I quote from a books description the book "focuses squarely on the dangers assailing the cornerstones of American life, pointing out how liberal propaganda and agendas are seeping into our churches, our schools, even our families." Now I am fairly certain that no one I work with would recommend this book. 90% of coworkers are liberal in one sense or the other. The other 10% are fairly normal middle of the road republicans (they are members of basic [brothers and sisters in Christ] and don't seem to care too much for our current situation in Iraq and so on). So my question is, why are we going through this current trend of super conservative republicans? Personally I blame our current leader and his puppeteers; I don’t have much else to say than that. What do you guys think? I demand answers.